Packs for Packrafting

Gear
21

Dear Shaggy,

You wrote: “you already drank the kool-aid! I would recommend inflating your Alpacka in a quiet, safe place and curling fetal inside of it until the water-angels stop telling to do large drops…”

Inflated the raft last weekend on the verandah, whilst making two “one off” [?two off] silinylon spray decks (yes, the verandah is a nice safe place, and I tried to curl up inside, as you suggested), but the “water angels didn’t tell me to do large drops”, so I’m not sure what to do next…Are there some non-prescription drugs needed here?..

Beyond all this, I’ll be fly-fishing and rafting a wilderness river in NZ in 6wks, so I’m at a stage in life where I really don’t give a sh… what happens…

I realise that you guys in Alaska seem to have miles of river to raft whenever, but in Oz we are in a bit of a drought, and finding a river with a decent rapid within 2hrs of Melbourne (the bottom of Oz) is a tad difficult - hence the excitement . I doubt that there are many of us packrafters in Oz - there were some impressive photos from Tasmania recently on the site (Tassie is the bottom-most state, even below Melbourne, which is a city in Victoria, the second bottom most state!

When I bought my first packraft, Sheri did mention that some guys had bought Alpackas for a trip down the Franklin R in Tassie - I wonder whether they are still alive - check out the piccies on http://www.pbase.com/tasmart/franklin_river, with particular reference to the photo named “Robbie in the Cauldron” towards the end, and then think about packrafting this…

I’d rather be curled up in a safe place in my yak, waiting for the water angels to …!

Andrew A

22

I plan on buying this pack for next summer’s canyoneering season, I am wondering how well it would work for packrafting as well. I’ll report on it next summer I guess. http://canyoneeringusa.com/shop/product.php?productid=16271&cat=105&page=1 Either way, Imlay Canyon Gear is very tough, as I have other items in the line.

23

Have any of you guys ever used Mystery Ranch packs? I’ve heard a lot positive about them, but they look a bit heavy & over-engineered on the website. Then again, I still do a lot using a stuff stack w/ a piece of 1" webbing sewn onto it…

24

Andrew,
Don’t worry: I didn’t believe in the water angels either until I got thoroughly trounced by a big wave, and pulled a full-on mystery move. Maybe I just bumped my head on the ocean floor… ha ha.

In any case, check out the real event, caught in photography. This is what I mean by Alpacka kool-aid: http://www.aktrekking.com/beyondSpec/

25

Yep, that looks like kool aid, and a bit of a headache.

Had a look at the site. Was interested to read about “poor men’s dry suits” and how only neoprene waders should be used, as in nylon/goretex waders one might turn “upside down and drown due to an air pocket forming in the legs”. This is a common myth, nicely debunked on http://www.sexyloops.com/articles/killerwader.shtml - in which a mad english bloke tries to drown himself using waders, but fails. Perhaps this will allow a “richer man’s dry suit” to be made…eg waders, wader belt, and thin neoprene top over, which is what we use if wishing to stay dry, but not nearly warm enough for your running of icy creeks

26

Andrewallan,

The Franklin can actually be a super-fun packrafting trip. Maybe there should be an international team of packrafters heading down it next year? I am sure there are a bunch of us who’d be keen to go. I for one would like to combine it with Mtn Ash-climbing trip with Tom Greenwood.

27

I kid in my high school drowned while duck hunting wearing waders. I wouldn’t tell his family that it is a myth.

28

Roman,

The piccies i’ve seen of the Franklin look a bit overwhelming for my packrafting skills, admittedly in high water, as per the link to the photos earlier. I’d be happy to lend Tom Greenwood a raft if you could convince him he’d love to go rafting there with you! With a wife and 4 kids, I just don’t need a “Robbie in the Cauldron” situation in a raft! We also have some good mainland rivers once the drought lifts, perhaps even near some 80m + trees?!! (for the last few years I have been overwhelmed by the enthusiastic dialogue I had with Tom one night about the excitement of tree climbing - here was something I knew nothing about, and had no interest in, but which I was absolutely fascinated by, as he was clearly SO enthusiastic about it!).


As to the waders thing, packraftnewmexico, I’m sure you CAN drown, as you CAN do in a bucket of water, but it would require you to at least ensure that the legs are filled with air, and then a waist belt is done up hermetically tight around your waist to stop this air escaping (hard to do - water always seems to get down past a waist belt if you go over the top of the waders), and for you then to leap into something deep, turn upside down, and not be able to use your arms to keep your head out of the water. This is not that easy to do from a practical point of view, except perhaps whilst duck shooting (see below).

If, on the other hand, you stand in waist deep water with the waders on, either before doing up the belt, or without a belt, the water pressure pushes the wader fabric against your skin and expels the air, and they are then no different to a pair of trousers, and you can swim in them quite nicely - I have.

A PFD also improves your odds, which one presumes one would wear rafting, but not duck shooting (or fishing). Perhaps he was standing in a boat with his waders well belted up, and then fell off into cold water, inhaled some cold water, got laryngospasm, and died from that ? One will never know, however drowning would be an extremely unpleasant way to go, in my opinion. Not wishing to detract from the sadness of packraftnewmexico’s school chum drowning, non-neoprene waders are a lot safer that some believe, and the concept of “automatically drowning if you go over the top of them” needs to be dispelled. The sexyloops site is pretty clear. Accidents will always happen, but the probablility of drowning in non-neoprene waders is small.

Anyway, before this thread goes TOO lateral, back to packs…I’ve already said my bit.

29

I know there are a lot of variables, especially in whitewater. I try to stay away from constants other than- it’s dangerous.

30

I finally found the perfect bag for day trips, or a wamr weather lightweight overnighter even. Ipicked this up today and will be using it tomorrow… very nice. perfect size. http://store.seattlesportsco.com/productcart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=12&idproduct=621

I grabbed the blue one (1800 CI)

31

From the Dial Style pic, it looks like Roman is “wearing” the MTI livery pfd? I need to get one of those.

John

32

Anyone try the Arcteryx NAOS packs??? I have the Arcteryx Bora and its bombproof. However the NAOS seems like a great combination between being waterproof and comfortable to hike with. Yeah they are expensive, but this way you only gotta buy a pack and forget about the dry bag. Just looking for input.


Thanks

Here’s a link with the info about these packs:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ARCTERYX-NAOS-70-NWT-SIZE-M-DRYBAG-SEALINE_W0QQitemZ220207356234QQihZ012QQcategoryZ36111QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

33

Sounds great - a bit like the Outdoor Research summit Pack but a lot bigger (the OR pack is perfect as a day pack/packrafting pack).

I’ll certainly check it out a bit more, as this sounds an “ultimate” pack for rafting/fishing/hiking

34

My ULA prototype pack distinctly does not have the shoulder straps tie into the dry bag. I carry upwards of 60-65 pounds in mine and threading it through a dry bag would not have worked…

Surprised that is the case with production models. Does it tie in or just thread through?

35

Roman,
The straps just thread through the holes in the POE dry sack. The buckles keep the straps from coming out - hopefully.

36

Carol,

Thanks for that tidbit.

I am surprised that Brian made it that way.

Roman

37

I have an OS Sumit for Packrafting. My wife tryed it this last weekend and fell in love with it. I ordered myself another one. Enough said! :unamused:

38

my two cents on the packs - for pure packrafting the aarn featherlite freedom is awesome.

its light, has a totally dry sleeve, and has awesome geometry for fast-packing with it’s balance pockets. i’ve used this pack on almost all of my packrafting trips.

it’s been redesigned a few times and is now even better.

if you’re just using it for packrafting - the balance pockets come in the ‘dry’ variety. they are also perfectly suited (no modifications necessary) to attach directly to the lash points up front on the boat. you can put one dry balance pocket on each side of the front tubes, lash the pack itself upside down (shoulder straps facing up) so that for portages, all you need to do is slip on the pack and go.

in a recent trip to the absarokee wilderness, i even used this system to climb up easy class 5 rock to avoid nasty rapids after having committed to an unknown gorge.

google aarn packs for more info. the packs are also hands down the best i’ve found for general backpacking - the balance pockets make the weight almost completely disappear - especially with heavier loads.

i’ve got photos but couldn’t get them on here…

39

Wow, I didn’t actually read all that, but I had a couple things to add that I don’t think are redundant:

Mesh vs. solid: For the panel that is against the packer’s back, I would just go with an ultra-ultra light nylon. You just don’t need much strength there. Erin made it for a year with a light nylon back and then had that panel evaporate only after we’d finished. And some nylon doesn’t seem to be a big deal as far as water absorption.

The pack-styles that I’ve given a serious test to are super simple (e.g. GoLite Gust) and frame to hold a dry-bag(e.g. Arctic 1000). I think there is potential to the latter, but the versions I tried kind of sucked. The Arctic 1000 is partly just poorly engineered… like weak stitches on strong fabric. But it’s also a pain and a practically needed my geology degree to figure out how to pack it. The super-simple GoLite Gust style seems to me to be the way to go.

As far as features I’d like to see:
-Light… I think a pack only needs to weigh 1.5 lbs. max
-Eric, I heard you mention using the paddles for structure. It seems like the paddles are a huge resource that should totally be taken advantage of. A perfect use of these would give the weight of a frameless pack with the structure of a frame pack. Erin and I have used paddles for structure in a number of ways in packs, and found it very helpful. But they’re still limited without having a brilliant system for integrating pack and paddles. One simple trick that works remarkably well is to pack one’s pack normally and tightly, then shove the blades inside the pack last, stretching the pack tight and giving it shape and structure.
-I’d like to have the pack arranged so that something (the shoulder straps or hip belt for example) was in a spot where it could be quickly grabbed when exiting on the beach and fleeing an oncoming ocean wave.
-Also think about how to make the pack to allow access to some of its contents while in the packraft. At least a little top-pouch that’s handy, or something like that.

And right now it’s a bit nippy for us Alaskans to be exploring any of the rivers in our back yard…

40

I bought the Arcteryx Naos 70L pack with my lovely dividend this year. I wanted one after I did a trip in Denali Park on my coleman raft, and the only thing I took that did not get soaked was my sleeping bag.

It is a well built pack and I do not ever want to go back to rain covers for a pack. Unfortunately, I have not had the opportunity to take it packrafting, but I can’t see any problems with it. It is a one compartment rolltop pack, and that main compartment is indeed waterproof, I have tested it. It has 3 zippered compartments that are highly water resistant. In the future I am sure I will mod the pack a little bit. Little things like some shock cord to stuff a jacket on the outside and stuff.